not sure how good the radiant team is
but if they are atleast mid skill team they gonna stomp the shit out of havoc&co
they got so much better pick
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The mid really suffered, i should have picked a different mid but it was my understanding that the lina should have won the matchup vs a SF
Top and bot did pretty well I though it just fell apart after a bit.
welp havoc its your fault. You can't pick that lineup with bad players (matrice good ofc). To win when the other team is better you gotta go for the gay tactics aka, defensive and with not many buttons, able to spam and disrupt with a single button and work even at lower exp levels.
Tide should've gone offlane, if banned smth, like bat/zombie/bb/cent. DD isn't bad but he can't support and carry a falling team with a doom, on the other hand any of the previously mentioned hero would be able to control the flow and make pickups/counterpickups easy.
Finding a good mid for COMPETITIVE gaming is hard and you should've known after the experience we had with allison. You can't give him Lina and expect him to win. Instead pick smth like panda/viper/magnus/sniper/lich/ta/zeus.
Lastly you picked a weak supporting duo not capable of fighting hard hitters in teamfights completely countering your safelane pick and best player matrice. You already had a weak Lina/Doom for fights, you followed up with a weak support duo and a late mid game carry. You had your weakest players deal with the weakest lineup against a fullblown and powerful setup of the enemy team.
IMO next time you have a mid you can't trust pick 1 support to help mid, a range carry for matrice that can solo their offlane and a jungle hero that could help matrice like enigma or just yolo it with axe and trust matrice will win top at least for the first 8 min.
Have lich stay mid for example and make it a dual. Your lina+doom+lich (with the respective players) would've worked with axe woods (teamfight) and a range carry.
It doesnt matter even if it was reversed, ville is a class above your player. He wasnt winning either way.
Sad that it didn't work out this time. But I guess there is a lot to learn for you from that match :)
Benao sry but youre silly if you say that lina is hard mid to master or hard to stomp with. She's extremely strong laner and few heroes can survive under extreme attack range and nuking harass potential of lina. She's good hero and definitely should have won mid against sf.
I didn't say is a hard mid to master, nor did I say she's hard to stomp with. I said COMPETITIVE is different than PUB games and it doesn't matter how fucking good that lina pubstomper is, he's gonna get RECT unless he can also play competitive.
It's a whole OTHER game. And knowing how it is i can tell you that giving lina to a player like him is a HUGE RISK and it's why it is better to go with the ones i mentioned.
Now i ask you, since i can understand it's harder for a 3k mmr player to understand. How much winrate do you think W33fresher has with MEEPO in competitive? And why do you think that is? And i am not only referring to his laning skills but MEEPO's usefulness mid to late game by how the game went. (Consider that for meepo to get big you have to sacrifice the other 4)
@Benao
I guess meepo in general has very low winrate on competitive scene, its more like a pub hero. Lina is roughly same good in pubs and in competitive dota; she's part of current metha.
idk who u were talking to when mentioning 3k mmr, but if im not mistaking, you are in high 4k tier, right? if so, ur mmr is actually lower than both Dravic's and mine, and therefore that point looks a bit like self-criticism, which is something you are not very familiar with, judging by your posts.
omfgomfgomfgomfg i replied and the shit dissapeared gg
it was to him since i assumed you just didnt think about you said and i know you're not 3k
i said 3k because he was 3k until he spammed meepo and got to where he is now. not that i care if he's 3k but i assumed he didnt know about the difference between pub and competitive from that assumption. -> and why he's wrong
well, i still consider lina to be not the worst hero to play against good sf, even on competitive level. although afair the game, it looked quite... sad; but imo its still not pick's fault (im not talking about other picks, just lina-sf).
ofc its not the picks fault, the total of 5 picks was bad but even so. My point was that you DON't pick lina for someone you can't rely on, simple as that. If you're gonna RISK it with lina then go dual with lich as i suggested ;)
if you cant rely on someone in your team, its alrdy quite bad, but in case you have to deal with it and pick at least something, among all the mid heroes lina is not the worst choice by far.
edit: well mb with lich dual it would have worked better, but i guess they didnt suppose things gonna get that bad. I think the guy playing Lina had some sort of bad day.
Lich was a good pick and helps keep lanes under control as well as give the armor buff which we needed from their team.
Honestly I taking on some of what others have said I think maybe swapping my support AA for something a little more active might have changed things as well as swapping the doom for something that could have held mid game while AM farmed.
Something like a BB/Lich offlane with an AM/Lion safe. I still don't feel the lina was that bad and he's done very good mids in the past and I guess it was just unlucky as well as a draft that had too much imput so less direction and kinda all over the place.
"if you cant rely on someone in your team" I currently rely on everyone that has played in the team so far, all of them are really good players and I won't swap them or get bitter cause of a lost game. Shit happens and it's just a game.
I think we possibly could have made the picks work if SF didn't snowball http://www.dotabuff.com/matches/1323238887 he got really farmed and they basically were like "fuck it, we're stronger now" and just 5 man pushed which we couldn't stop at all. The graph says it all 20 minutes and we basically couldn't hold their 5.
@Havoc Badger
When you cite this part of my post, it looks kinda rude without context, and thats not what i meant. i dont think u didnt rely on some1, and even if u actually didnt, it doesnt matter, its just a game. What I wrote was about hypothetical situation Benao offered.
we have different definitions of relyong on people!
people i rely on for a role will sometimes lose but not ever, in any case let an enemy snowball in a 1v1 situation. Worst case scenario is the enemy having freefarm while only getting some farm.
From what i see this guys mentality, aka pub mentality was to try and kill sf at every possible opportunity and fed as a result ofc because of the skill difference! Thought omg this noob got lucky and killed me with run/luckyraze/gank and tried again, etc.
what i think went through his head:
me better player, me better hero, me rape this guy anytime, me yolo, me responsibility is to kill him, me responsibility is to STOP his ownage with killing him (2 levels under).
then transitioned to smth like i gotta do what i can and share farm (3 levels under 1 raze 2 hit gg), position like shit and diieeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee.
Worst case scenario for a better player:
A smart player would, in case of noticing the skill difference (enemy being better), dragon slave from safety and not bother denying, instead harrasing sf with every lh he takes. More dragon slave, etc and even if he was losing at some point in terms of cs, SF never felt safe and farmed at 80% getting 0 kills!!!!!!!!!!
lol dravic lina has one of the pooorest attack animations and projectile speeds i know tons of mid players who refuse to play storm for that reason
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