well i would, but i still have places too be and doing pretty much nothing (work)...
which is good as i have time to write something like this while getting Money (sitting at work) or reading guides or cool opinions like this...
most of the time i wish i knew someone with high mmr sitting next to me and giving me tips while i Play ranked... to improve the right way. I understand that you can get better if you Play more. But you also develop in my opinion many bad Habits, which hinders your improvement... i think i am currently stuck and know no way out... hence i jump from role to role.
I guess my Overall game improves, but not to an extend to exploit my enemies more than they exploit mine or my Team...
Communication in this game is garbage... only flaming going on... sadly. But I often jump on this Train to try to convice the mates to think bout their game and not blame others...
And my drafting sucks which i wanted to improve, but well... i just narrowed my hero pool to pick heroes i like...
@OP:
Can you tl:dr that? I mean holy moly, i usually do read longer text's, but that shit is way to long.
tl;dr:
win laning stage as carry, but fail mid/lategame due to my Team brawling too much or didn't contribute and farm when we are way ahead, so the enemy can catch up.
As Support it's just sad to see an carry lasthitting like garbage and it feels like wiping their asses... but still you can contribute at all stages with cc and better positioning, which is really hard.
Mid Hero, well flamewar starts... and i hate most mid heroes anyway, so i dropped the idea of playing mid...
It's common believe that the mid Player wins the lane all the time and gets the game, else the enemy mid wins and gets the game (which is true to some Content, because the lack of supports).
Offlane, even if you get solo offlane and didn't die (at this mmr i believe if you have solo offlane then you also have a jungler) you still loose. only if the enemy has a jungler, too, you have a decent 50% Chance to win, by just the positioning.
the rest is just personal experience the last 3 weeks and some whining because i don't know what to do :/
keep playing
imo live coaching doesn't work at all. i've tried to coach some people (2k) and i was coached by some (6.5k) as well, and neither of that worked. it's incredibly difficult to pay attention to what the person tells you and to the game itself at the same time and most of the times you do things much less efficiently than you would, you react slower, you stop looking at the minimap, etc. - this happened in both cases
the best thing you can do is watching replays or get someone to watch them
If your back to support- try Omniknight and Abaddon. They are tankier supports (if you get caught out of position) that can save dumb carries. They can help with wards and banking, but they shine in letting your carries live through their terrible mistakes. Your slark just jumped into 3 of them? A few well placed heals and shields and he's out. The best part is that these guys are best at supporting but can situationally perform pretty much any other position decently. Team forgot to pick an offlaner- just be an offlaner. No one went mid?- go mid omni. They are very versatile.
But what do I know. My mmr is lower then yours.
@arin
Watching my own replays is kinda difficult (as i have not soo much free time). And I mostly use the time playing the game and quickly look a replay while eating or while waiting for my mate to ready up.
And mostly I don't know at what stuff i have to look to improve.
As carry i mostly watch my farm, cs/lasthitting and networth.
As Support I check if i could've outzoned the enemy or tp to prevent a death at my time or turn a Teamfight (but latetly I am contribute to nearly 100% of the fights as Support).
And in all games I look if I had the right feel if my Team was ahead at this time or that time or behind.
And if I correctly identified the main threat to my Team as Support.
It's really hard to understand the teamfights at my current gameknowledge as i lack to see which i could do better to turn the fight around.
Any tips?
@brooster77
i know Omni and Abaddon have a high winrate at all stages. They are utterly boring too Play. And too defensive for my style. As the lack of good teamplay and Initiation at low mmr (my believes) i am constantly unpatient that nobody exposed an enemy off Position. Hence i prefer supports which could initiate (bane).
But sure Omni and Abaddon i guess can work wonders. But well I am garbage with defensive supports (dazzle, abaddon and omni).
@arin:
I'd say it depends on the coach. I coached a shitfuck who was sitting on 1.9 - 2.1k now he's 2.5k, if he would stop playing party all the time he would prolly make it to 3k.
@OP:
Honestly, find yourself a proper coach or watch your own replays.
@Kathy
i recently started saving all my replays, but i don't know where to look at to improve.
Mostly i just look if i had the right feel which Team was in the lead (networth). as carry if my farm was decent (I always try to aim to get ~60 LH at 10 Minute mark).
And if I *cc'd* the right enemy as Support. I latetly started to spam wards with every Gold i have. Constantly buying wards and just place em where i think my Team is headed to, too see a gank soon enough to prepare.
*hug the lane with carry* IF you aren't outzoning the enemy, stack pulling camps to create space for carry to farm, then you being in the lane is essentially leeching exp. Get out of your carry's way if you don't think that you can help in any way. If your carry is going to die if you leave the lane, at least leave the xp gain zone and try and harass your enemies. If your carry will die even with your presence, don't bother staying in the safelane. Gank other lanes to force rotations = space for your carry/mid/offlane to farm.
@raymond: thanks, thats what i already learned and will try more in the future as Support.
Even though you have sometimes still be there to countergank or to avoid your carry chainfeeding.
As I am currently transisting again into Support as my gameknowledge and Position got better. Which i think i mostly stop feeding and help my Team more with CC. Also as i tried to learn to carry I pretty much learned much about lasthitting and this benefitting my Support role, too.
I would rather play carry, which I enjoy more with decent teammates. But I will now try to play Support as your Team mostly lack supports at this mmr stage.
I guess i was in the spiral down learning curve Syndrom. And performed bad game after game in this loosing strike and was out of Option to Focus on my play and stay positive. Hence i used this to vent some pressure.
go add me, i will help you a little bit
start to think bout my bad habbits a bit... tried to Point them out, but it's rather hard to try to find the Trigger or correct them
could Need some advice helping me out here
1) farming in contested or dangerous space -> i am eager to do farming or fighting, if we loose map control and have bad teamfight abilities or underfarmed core's, i try to farm even though i know there is no ward, i start farming, but getting ganked a lot (maybe a ward helps, but also i am mostly constantly with 6 items at this stage of the game)
Sometimes I take risks to farm, even when i am ahead... it's hard to regain mapcontrol... and the only non danger Zone is the base at this time (any advice?)
2) getting impatient and start the fight, sometimes dying first in the teamfight as the result initiating as carry, because after 2+ mins constantly Standing in front of the enemy as 4/5 man doing nothing makes me go nuts... i tried with going to farm near my Team, but sometimes the enemy jumps me or just rekts my Team and i couldn't contribute in the fight (advice?)
3) bkb, i rarely buy bkb, i guess a bkb is the least item i buy in this game... because i see myself so often have it and couldn't use it, because i use it after the first stun and it doesn't work, chainstun->dead.... no Chance to bkb (i don't want to Pop the bkb too early... could anyone give me his thoughts about activating the bkb?)
4) decision making - teamfight wise... i know you should concentrate on the squishy Targets first, but often they stay at the backline... it's hard to get near them even as weaver... how does you handle it? (mostly i don't buy Utility items as carry)
5) too much farm/fighting, missing the timeframe ~ often i Play f.e. juggernaut and the enemy has a hard-carry like dusa/am... by most means i can never outfarm them... and often i farm so much that i miss my timeframe and couldn't push well to give me Team the upperhand... hence the enemy carry gets to big and rek us...
also on my shadow shaman Play yesterday i had the Problem that i had the Feeling that one spell of the enemy could kill me (got ganked/killed easily)... hence i forced myself to buy a bracer which leads to 0 wards on our Team... and blaming me for not putting up wards at all... as i got wards, we had 0 map control and no will to regain the mapcontrol at all...
i never felt safe behind any teammate as the enemy just jumped me and instagibbed me...
also one Thing which bugs me is, i often get flamed (no wards as Support, not contributing in all teamfights etc.) - this makes me angry and i guess i perform worse after got flamed... but also i don't want to miss important calls so i feel uneasy when i mute all mates...
i guess muting all and just start playing would be best for my mindset... because i tend to start arguing instead concentrating on the game...
I didn't read your entire post, but i was in your mmr and what I can tell you is that playing well no matter the hero is how you will win. Granted you have more control as a carry or mid, but it's the best way. Playing heroes you're comfortable with/ know well is also a good way.
For example I play a lot of pudge and mirana, which a lot of people would argue are bad heroes or don't fit into the meta or whatever. They're not wrong, however I know the heroes so well that I can outplay people at my mmr because of their lack of knowledge of said hero. Even with AA, whom you never see picked, I used to play a lot and win a lot because people just don't know what the hero does, and you can take advantage of that.
Play who you're comfortable with (ideally a hero that fits into the lineup, first picking isnt ideal but it's better than losing gold), and try to consciously have the biggest impact on the game as you can.
I think you already have a good game sense, you just need to improve more on your mechanic.
At low mmr below 3,8k I never want to go as dual lane. I go solo mid, solo roamer or ganker support, and solo offlane (if there's a jungler on my team). Having a team mates nearby usualy disturb me, as they don't do any good rather leeching exp, or disrupting the farm, competing for last hits or just too passive to do anything.
i mean i spammed jugg a bit, i have 66+% winrate with him even more if you just look at the last month where i did some homework for him and constantly adjust my item build to fit my playstyle... even trying to understand which item affects him... i Play decent/good with him at my mmr ... i usually got farm (not as much as my target is ~60 LH @ 10 Minute) but i get kills early...
I often rek the mid game with juggernaut and then failing hard transisting to the lategame...
As my friend (same mmr as myself) pointed out that i am doing mostly not enough Herodamage (mostly #3 as carry), but my Towerdamage is always great...
Can't tell if I fight wrong, but the habbit stays, i push, i die, my Team fights and dies... happens too often :/
See that failure but fail at Fixing the failure
Finally a thread that takes me more than 30 seconds to read! Well done.
Let me give you some advice. Most of my accounts range from 3.5k to 4k MMR, but I have been where you are so I know what its like.
It will take some time to rise much in MMR, even if you are far better than your current score because so many games are required. One way you can rise despite a bad team is to totally dominate the game with a ganking hero. Here is an example game I played at 2.4k MMR.
https://www.dotabuff.com/matches/1222759036
This works if you are much faster so you can consitently outplay players at your current MMR. But if you are only slightly more skilled a more strategic approach is required.
Here is an example of a game I played at about 3.2k MMR.
https://www.dotabuff.com/matches/1759038013
I was still dominant, but not so completely and my team managed to feed away every advantage I gave them. The closer you get to an MMR where people are equally skilled the harder it becomes to win games consistently. When you are playing against similarly skilled opponents you have to have a strategy to win games instead.
The first step is maximize your skill on the hero you are using by playing it exclusively for a while. Juggernaut would be the best choice for you since you have already played a lot of games with it and have succeded.
By your sucess and experience I expect that you have mastered the basic concept of how to split push and then tp out while magic immune if you cannot instantly kill a defender with omni-slash. This is a very good way to win Normal Skill games.
But at some point the whole enemy team will come to focus you. Some might even use blink disables. You need to be able to judge before fighting if they have back up or not and this means you need to place your own wards since supports will probably fail to do it.
When you go out to split push as juggernaut have an obs or two and know how to place them to see the main areas of approach behind the tower you are pushing. This can be done for every tower on the map. You have to learn the right ward spots.
The next step is to be able to sustain pressure on the tower despite the enemy hunting you. For this you need to force them to make the big map movements while you maintain flexibility. You have phase boots at the end of the game 83% of time. This is a major error. Phase is good on jugg early but you need to change to Boots of Travel as soon as you are ready to split push. Of the 13 games where you did get BoT you won 12. That's a 92% winrate.
If just one hero comes to stop you, kill them and keep pushing. But if many heroes rotate, you will see this with your wards and know to port to the opposite side of the map and continue push-farming. This will force the other team to either chase you around the map, giving space to your team or to lose towers. If they are pushing into your base and you are pushiing into theirs they will be forced to send two heroes back to stop you because just one will die to omni-slash (ghost -> forcestaff counters, but that's unlikely at 2.3k MMR) if they use invisibility to escape you can easily have a dust. When they send 2 or more heroes to stop you this means your team now has a 4 v 3 fight to defend. And with BoT you can immediately switch lanes on them when they come.
These tactics should give you a very high win % for juggernaut in Normal Skill games and will move your overall juggernaut strategy to the next level. Once you run into trouble with this you will need to add shadow blade and/or blink dagger to your build situationally... but there is no need for that complication yet. Just learn to use wards and BoT consitently first.
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Hello guys,
often i realize too late how bad a game can go if all wants to be the star Player.
I started with Support as I am a quite defensive personality in Reallife and thought that is my playstyle. I utterly failed, because of lack of gameknowledge, itemization, mapawareness and most of all positioning.
After several games positioning is still the hardest, because it comes with mapawareness and gameknowledge... also it hardly depends on your mates. It is most of the time that you try to stay behind the Team, and run again behind the Team and again and again and then stand inside the fountain or base without a fight ever happend, because all guys are quite defensive and never start a favourable fight.
It's quite the opposite if the enemy Team is clearly ahead that the Team mostly just tilt and blindly jump in to end the game quicker... sometimes a comeback is real with this style of Play, but in my personal experience it's only 2-3% of the games that this happens.
I often saw a carry autohitting creeps and I was constantly trying to get the lane Equilibrium back to our Tower or asking the carry to stop aa the creeps... rarely happens, you just gets flamed.
As I pulled the lane my carry often dies against the enemy dual lane. Stacking camps... well no carry at this mmr i guess is utilizing this by the extend i see in pro games. As you are often the only Support and try to help the carry, you see yourself hugging the lane with the carry and the other lanes fail... as to my gameknowledge wasn't that high on that state of my *Progress*...
After this i tried a diversity of heroes, mostly carries or offlaners and sometimes QoP/TA mid...
Well it was decent... mid is quite hard to win with not so great mid heroes. As I dislike most of the mid heroes, i just abadoned this role and tried to concentrate on offlaners first.
I read guides and tried to get the gameknowledge off. I usually rarely died, but getting LH under Tower seems quite hard, but still managed to get XP all the time without much danger. But still i had nearly an Impact to the midgame as the other lanes crumble most of the times or it was even... and we still lost mid game.
I then tried to train broodmother to raise mmr/have fun and outplay my enemies. As my friend stated that Brood can win 1vs9 if you are very good with her. I don't think i was a good brood or quite better then my enemy, but a decent brood, not much chainfeeding going on and constantly getting the attention of 2+ mostly 3 enemy heroes. Just to see the other lane crumble against 1/2 heroes and the safelane carry getting harrassed/zoned out/ganked... and was farming badly trying to get kills too early aso...
After ~35+ games as brood with a 40% winrate i dropped the idea to get early Towers... i guess at this mmr range 2k-2.8k the carries hardly utilize the space given by a brood. Even if you beg them to pressure the other Towers or farm to their a** off, they all think they are the one and only and Play how they want, and hardly ever listen to anything or anyone.
And at the low mmr i guess shutting down the game early (min 20-25) is hardly out of question. It only works if all lanes are won and you wombo stomp the enemy Team, or vice versa.
I then transisted to carry... well it was awful, most of the time my Team picked cores which timeframe is as my knowledge quite high min 30-35+. Or even with a narrow timeframe Hero, which could produce good results in early game, they just outfarmed their timeframe and died against that spectre min 45+... and I saw myself needed to defend the base at min 15-18... which was not a good time for a spectre/tb/jugger/Sven... without a Support or max 1 Support and 3 lategame mates.
Usually I tried to get help here or at reddit and getting coached for juggernaut. It was delightful and i learned quite a bit. But it's still very hard to predict a game. I see 3 early game heroes, which I think can win early game and they just failed against 4 carries...
I didn't know where to get farm as i was constantly sitting without any ward to secure our jungle. I tried to get farm solo with nearly 0 space and often got ganked, because of the lack of defensive Play and warding...
I just saw that my LH/GPM was lacking hardly and I still hasn't got my core items and just jungled to try to get my items and got owned by the enemy Team. As jugger f.e. sometimes I just owned the lane with 5+ kills and max 1 death. And then the enemy concentrate on me and just focused me in everyfight or gank attemp and it was very hard to had fun after the laning stage/early game (min 12+). AS they 5 man and just constantly owned my Team and i was trying to farm and defend. If i farmed my Team feeded them and they got biggen than me, even though they were 5 man playing and I should've outfarmed them, but they got the Gold from kills, much more as i got from farming. Hence I tried to transist more into early/mid game jugger, which is why i picked jugger...
I started to get the hang of early Play as written before 5+ kills early game wasn't rare on my side, still i couldn't convince my Team to go aggressive and get the objectives. Mostly i was split pushing/pushing alone. I got the Towers, but sometimes they jumped me and killed me anyway.
Still i like Juggernaut, but i find him lacking in the lategame as at my mmr my Team mostly fails to secure the game early (pre min 25).
Or I am just not good enough to never die with him and deny the enemy the comeback Gold.
And by all means I tried to be polite and ask the Team to help or to push, they just utterly flame anyone. F.e. the Mid hero which completly got destroyed and asked for gank, but nobody ganked as at this mmr ppl still believe it's the mid's Job to stomp the lane and win the other lanes and that it's not the supports Job to gank. I never expected that all lanes go well, but ppl refuse to back off and try something different. They constantly trying to get farm at this lane and increase the chances to chainfeed the enemy laner.
I was having this Trouble, too. Too eager to WIN the lane, even though i was behind or our dual lanes was quite outplayed by their duallane...
I read in guides to always carry a TP and i tried it, but hell there is nearly 0 towerdives. If someone dies, they just die in the middle of the river, becuase they never go back. Like no-retreat-no-surrender Thing going on here at laning stage.
Ppl refuse to Switch lanes. F.e. a spectre getting an aggressive premade tri-lane against her refuse to solo offlane against an solo offlane. Because the dual top lane couldn't compete against the premade aggressive tri-lane...
So I had enough to carry my Team and most of the time was hindered useless because we lost all Towers min 10 and i saw no possibility to win the fights if I joined, even said i tried both. I tried to farm till they tried rax and splitpush the hell out of it, to try to trade Tower for Tower... still doesn't work... there's too much brawling going on....
I mean it's mostly 2+ kills per Minute at this bracket (i don't know if this is true at higher mmr brackets) but as a former hon Player... i really hate this style of Play. Farming mostly doesn't matter, just brawl better if the enemy doesn't back out (remeber the no retreat no surrender Thing going on at this mmr)...
So yeah, if you farm and your Team brawls, you as carry are behind if you farm (or my farming is not good enough)... because the enemy or your Team gets more Gold fighting. Mostly both, but one Team leads and continue to win at this Point, because killgold is reliable Gold... they don't loose so much Gold constantly brawling... and if they gank you 2-3 times with 5 man out of nowhere or make you stay in base as melee carry, you still get 0 LH because as i see all ppl with aoe abilities just spam the waves. Supports and other ppl alike.
Now I am back to Support again i guess, it's still hard to see crap carries never utilize the space i create and it often feels like wiping their a**es because they utterly are bad farmers. But the lack of supports in my games made me Play Support more often (most of the time bane).
I don't Play often, but it's a shame to be ahead with juggernaut and then utterly fail because your Team don't want to end the game before they got their core items, too (radiance on necro or phoenix, bf+deso on ember) aso...
And they farm poorly.. I saw necros spamming q and getting 1 LH every wave for 10 mins split pushing, gotten gank and even loss Gold in the process.
I know I have to approve my game... and I can't tell that I am way better then my mates. I just see I fail often getting picked off.. I just made a bad decision and try to improve my decision making. I just seem not to apply most guide/tips at his mmr, because all ppl lack. And to raise at constant Level you have to exploit the enemies weaknesses.... but by all means I am not *way better* as the enemy.. hence i can't exploit it. But i think i got up a Level with Coachings and reading pretty much stuff...
But still i failed to raise MMR. It was quite a Desaster this Weekend honestly... 1-7 Solo mmr I guess... mostly whiners, Feeders and leavers. Everygame was a jungler in my Team contributing nothing... that's why I have this nick now 'pick jungle and i leave'...
And techies... wow... 3 games techies.. I didn't saw techies for Ages.. and as i started solo ranked, 2/3 in a row i almost puked...
As far is I am concerned I know try to utilize a heropool of:
Carry: Weaver, Juggernaut & Sven
Mid: Warlock, Alchemist
Offlane: Bristleback, Weaver, Enchantress maybe... depends on the Team
Support: Bane, maybe Shadow Shaman (which is one of my favs but i just played him bad)...
just my thoughts.... so far